[wg11-owl] Re: Paper: Criticism of the STEP Application Module approach

[David Leal]

Dear Ed and other WG11ers,

The paper is attached.

You say:
>But as to the SC4 definitions, they are what they are, and the EXPRESS
models we have reflect the depth of our mutual understanding.  If we need to
discard most of the existing definitions in order to get the EXPRESS models
to make any sense, there isn't much value to the STEP models, and whether we
convert them to ontologies" is irrelevant to their uselessness.
>
>I don't believe that. My purpose is to get these models turned into
"ontologies" of the OWL kind, *so that* we can evaluate both the utility of
the EXPRESS models as an "engineering ontology" and the utility of DLs of
the OWL kind to engineering applications.

Unfortunately I do believe that - the negative assessment is true in many
cases. The STEP methodology can fix-up ill-defined concepts by specific
usages within an AP, but as soon as the concepts are converted into an
ontology, the failings are exposed and need to be fixed. The creation of an
'ontology' of ill-defined concepts is a complete waste of time.

Best regards,
David

At 10:39 07/06/2005 -0400, you wrote:
>David Leal wrote:
>
>> Lothar's paper is very welcome, however it is more than a 'criticism of the
>> STEP application module approach'. Lothar's paper shows the problems that
>> are caused by the vague definitions of the concepts at the heart of STEP -
>> product, product category, product_definition_formation, and
product_definition.
>
>I do not know the paper to which David's email refers.
>Can someone point me to this paper?
>
>> If we are to do anything with OWL, then we need concepts with precise
>> definitions. Lothar lists some concepts/terms that we should be able to
>> define, and suggests subclass-superclass relationships between them. What
>> about starting by defining these concepts, and creating a useful engineering
>> ontology.
>
>I think the idea of creating an engineering ontology is an excellent 
>academic research activity, and I might hope that one or two 
>universities are already engaged in it.
>
>But as to the SC4 definitions, they are what they are, and the EXPRESS 
>models we have reflect the depth of our mutual understanding.  If we 
>need to discard most of the existing definitions in order to get the 
>EXPRESS models to make any sense, there isn't much value to the STEP 
>models, and whether we convert them to "ontologies" is irrelevant to 
>their uselessness.
>
>I don't believe that.  My purpose is to get these models turned into 
>"ontologies" of the OWL kind, *so that* we can evaluate both the utility 
>of the EXPRESS models as an "engineering ontology" and the utility of 
>DLs of the OWL kind to engineering applications.
>
>-Ed
>
>P.S. High-level ontological classes, like Product, are deliberately 
>large and have very few critical properties.  The question is whether 
>the EXPRESS models reflect the critical properties.  And I agree that in 
>some cases, they don't!  But the value to SC4 is to identify those 
>cases, not to start over.
>
>-- 
>Edward J. Barkmeyer                        Email: edbark at nist.gov
>National Institute of Standards & Technology
>Manufacturing Systems Integration Division
>100 Bureau Drive, Stop 8264                Tel: +1 301-975-3528
>Gaithersburg, MD 20899-8264                FAX: +1 301-975-4694
>
>"The opinions expressed above do not reflect consensus of NIST,
>  and have not been reviewed by any Government authority."
>
>
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David Leal
CAESAR Systems Limited
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Lee London SE12 0BS
Tel:      +44 (0)20 8857 1095
e-mail:   david.leal at caesarsystems.co.uk
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